tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post6844628277910285037..comments2024-03-27T16:27:03.093+02:00Comments on Shiloh Musings: Wounded in My Own Home by the Forces of the State of IsraelBatyahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-75293109381933095852012-08-10T04:30:57.452+03:002012-08-10T04:30:57.452+03:00>> the humanity of the Jew who is being remo...>> the humanity of the Jew who is being removed from his or her home and to work automatically<br /><br />the day before, he may have been removing Beduin squattors from THEIR illegally-built homes in the Negev, or an Arab family squatting in E.Jerusalem. And believe me, all of the above had no real place to go afterwards. Those homes were also not "legal", but they also were homes. Full of children. Would you have preferred the Magav to sit around and "think about" whether removing those folks from their illegal home was "right to do", whilst removing you from yours was not to be done? See, you're already thinking like a Somalian militia war-lord.<br /><br />Please note that at no time or no place did I advocate withdrawals. I completely share your belief that they are gigantic political mistakes in every way. I just don't think we need to diss the Magav. They were not established as a political police nor do they act as one. They are the Shock Force of the police. Every country has such a squad. Try rioting in Singapore or Switzerland, you'll be kissing nightsticks in no time. You didn't even get anything more than a baby bodycheck. They ==did== go more gently with you than they did with the Anarcho party animals in Tel Aviv a few weeks back.Alanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11160350570530717935noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-69183901966690581642012-08-10T00:31:01.155+03:002012-08-10T00:31:01.155+03:00Thanks, Batya, for your words of encouragement, an...Thanks, Batya, for your words of encouragement, and Anonymous, Alan and Shy Guy for your comments. Civil disobedience is a tightrope, a "very narrow bridge". According to the IDF code of conduct for soldiers, it is forbidden to carry out an order which is immoral. The conscripted soldier, who is only in the army for a limited time and then returns to civilian life, has a broader perspective and can, if an independent thinker, ask the hard questions about what he has been told -- maybe. The career soldier, with years of training behind him designed to turn him into as much of a robot as possible, as well as the fear of losing his salary and livelihood, is much less able to achieve freedom of will in this regard. More specifically, these soldiers, policemen and guardsmen are specifically trained to dissociate, to fuzz out of real response to the humanity of the Jew who is being removed from his or her home and to work automatically. So this group is not likely to have such a heavy heart while carrying out such orders. They are also brainwashed into believing that the settlers are misguided people who put themselves and Israel in harm's way and they are doing us all a service by taking them out. As we saw from what happened in Gaza and we most likely will see soon from what will happen in Sinai, the policy of withdrawal is misguided at best. But you can't expect all soldiers to be wiser than Menachem Begin.goyisherebbehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09380171052449799815noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-45052831626145491732012-08-09T09:45:39.248+03:002012-08-09T09:45:39.248+03:00Yeh, Alan. We shouldn't have been angry at Ger...Yeh, Alan. We shouldn't have been angry at Germany's Nazi soldiers for following orders, either.<br /><br />Sure.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-48559824026030138192012-08-09T04:14:46.986+03:002012-08-09T04:14:46.986+03:00Very, very heartbreaking situation. After much tho...Very, very heartbreaking situation. After much thought, my belief is still: we can't be angry at sworn officers who are following legal orders. Otherwise, the situation becomes like Somalia. Even the Zealot government had cops who did what they were ordered to do. "Passive resistance" is still viewed (by the cop who now has to carry you) as getting in his face while he does his job. You can hardly contradict that it is a flavor of resisting a lawful order to disperse. And he has been (correctly, I think we agree) trained that resisting a legal order is in itself a crime. He thinks he's showing you mercy for not actually arresting you for the crime you just committed. Magavnikkim might be arsim or sachim, but if you didn't have arsim in the Magav, you'd get post-zionists or Leftists. At the end of the day, their (& soldiers) willingness to follow orders IS THE ONLY THING that makes Israel a State. To a cop, your attempts to resist an order to disperse put you in the same category as a hit-and-run driver. We all understand that it is not only the surgeon who has the duty to break the sabbath to save a life, but also guy who washes the floor of the operating room. So if you want better magavnikkim.... send your children to the Magav. In real life ONLY a leadership-by-example works. Writing things like, "the kind of people who join the Police" will not change the Police; it will only make them think you are stuck up. Of course, to STAY in the Magav, you might need to obey some (lawful) orders that you disagree with; for all we know, the Magavnikkim in this story WERE crying inside. But they did their job. Fasting on a fast day isn't fun either; you don't do it because you love to fast. You do it because you believe that otherwise the system falls apart.Alanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11160350570530717935noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-82545368698015270222012-08-08T07:02:26.175+03:002012-08-08T07:02:26.175+03:00our youth has great energy, and great love for isr...our youth has great energy, and great love for israel. <br />we destroy them when we teach that it is ok to build sans permits. get the permits, and build without end!<br />we have so much energy, lets focus it in an area where we can do some lasting good, instead of setting our youth against other jews and our state.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-35328311224340127652012-08-08T06:44:15.546+03:002012-08-08T06:44:15.546+03:00goyish, thanks for posting
refuah shleimahgoyish, thanks for posting<br />refuah shleimahBatyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.com