tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post6368201907803301403..comments2024-03-27T16:27:03.093+02:00Comments on Shiloh Musings: Peace Treaties With The Arabs Are Forbidden, Written in The BibleBatyahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-58559527137614727642012-08-14T06:16:27.290+03:002012-08-14T06:16:27.290+03:00In light of today's situation, limiting the ba...In light of today's situation, limiting the ban to ancient peoples who don't exist today makes no sense. The Torah is eternal. And, yes, I'd argue it with any rabbi.Batyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-78216204983303327042012-08-14T00:18:45.060+03:002012-08-14T00:18:45.060+03:00The specific "them" as the first comment...The specific "them" as the first commenter noted refers to ther Seven Nations. And they only. They are also liable to the laws of cherem in the most punishable sense, as well. For sure, there is a body of Rabbinic literature dealing with entering into a brit with non-Jews in connection with the Land of Israel and even Avraham suffered because of what he did with Avimelech with the Rashbam asserting thsat the Akeidah was directly related to the making the covenant in which Avraham yielded the Eretz Plishtim.<br />The Midrash Shmuel even has seven Tzaddikim being killed and Seven Houses of God (Tabernacles & Temples) destroyed because of that covenant.<br /><br />But, we do know the Rambam's opinion that Muslims are not idol worshippers and so this wouldn;t apply.<br />So, while the specific verses are not supportive of the paradigm, indeed, the Torah has lessons for us.YMedadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14333122797414935958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-55996941193163986502012-08-14T00:18:15.447+03:002012-08-14T00:18:15.447+03:00The specific "them" as the first comment...The specific "them" as the first commenter noted refers to ther Seven Nations. And they only. They are also liable to the laws of cherem in the most punishable sense, as well. For sure, there is a body of Rabbinic literature dealing with entering into a brit with non-Jews in connection with the Land of Israel and even Avraham suffered because of what he did with Avimelech with the Rashbam asserting thsat the Akeidah was directly related to the making the covenant in which Avraham yielded the Eretz Plishtim.<br />The Midrash Shmuel even has seven Tzaddikim being killed and Seven Houses of God (Tabernacles & Temples) destroyed because of that covenant.<br /><br />But, we do know the Rambam's opinion that Muslims are not idol worshippers and so this wouldn;t apply.<br />So, while the specific verses are not supportive of the paradigm, indeed, the Torah has lessons for us.YMedadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14333122797414935958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-57013185856646296862012-08-13T22:17:46.588+03:002012-08-13T22:17:46.588+03:00You're so right. Everyone else is wrong. R. Ah...You're so right. Everyone else is wrong. R. Aharon Lichtenstein must be incapable of learning chumash.MJnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-40641077552959183092012-08-12T19:54:45.509+03:002012-08-12T19:54:45.509+03:00a, you're not being exact. I'm quoting, a...a, you're not being exact. I'm quoting, and you're not. Torah definition of wife is "ezer kinegdo," meaning equal. I don't know where you get your bad information. <br />There are major differences between individual and national mitzvot. How to act as a People is what I'm writing about. the Torah quotation make a lot of sense.Batyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-21669395398955717392012-08-12T10:53:19.097+03:002012-08-12T10:53:19.097+03:00well, the torah also says that husbands are the ma...well, the torah also says that husbands are the master of their wives and that people who have extramarital sex or break the sabbath should be executed. i think we can all agree that following the torah to the letter is not always the correct or moral thing to do.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-38876633339669124842012-08-07T23:18:15.910+03:002012-08-07T23:18:15.910+03:00Cubanito, I'm even more worried by your opinio...Cubanito, I'm even more worried by your opinions.<br />We are supposed to apply the Torah to everyday life. That's how Judaism has survived. <br />And if you really think that we shouldn't, then how can the Rambam tell us what the modern Arabs are? <br />I don't know where you get your ideas from. Sorry, but you're not making any sense.Batyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-36580098201971326132012-08-07T18:15:20.401+03:002012-08-07T18:15:20.401+03:00I am quite worried that you apply this passage in ...I am quite worried that you apply this passage in Torah to present-day Israel.<br /><br />These pssukim speak about ovdey avodah zarah. Muslims are not ovdey avodah zarah, they are, by and large, considered bney noach. (I think Rambam writes about that).<br /><br />Secondly: those pssukim speak about peoples that are long extinct. If you are going to apply those verses to present-day palestinans, I worry that you once might identify "amalek" and execute the genocide against amalek, as ordered in the bible.Cubanitonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-44104284768971285282012-08-06T07:00:24.959+03:002012-08-06T07:00:24.959+03:00Hadassa, but the Torah says that the basis of a &q...Hadassa, but the Torah says that the basis of a "peace treaty" means that we recognize their rights, and that is forbidden.Batyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-89809299149925306192012-08-05T23:09:01.024+03:002012-08-05T23:09:01.024+03:00Shalom!
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think t...Shalom!<br />Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that anon hasn't understood yet that the laws written in the Torah are applicable at all times, except for those contingent on the presence of the Temple and the Sanhedrin, most of which are still binding under rabbinic rulings.<br />Even if it was permissible to make a peace treaty with the Arabs they have given no signs, and in fact quite the opposite, that they are worthy of one.Hadassanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-12182431895653981182012-08-05T18:06:59.069+03:002012-08-05T18:06:59.069+03:00Edward, Moriah, thanks
a,what isn't clear?Edward, Moriah, thanks<br />a,what isn't clear?Batyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-68779467938571555482012-08-05T18:05:12.000+03:002012-08-05T18:05:12.000+03:00I wish you would explain.I wish you would explain.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-43789399874689153642012-08-05T17:38:21.711+03:002012-08-05T17:38:21.711+03:00To anon #1 : The Torah also states: Will a leopard...To anon #1 : The Torah also states: Will a leopard change it's spots? Will there suddenly step up a faction in the Arab world to make peace with Israel? Will the generation that has been watching the equivalent to "Murder the Jews Mickey Mouse club" and all the other 24/7 hate Jew incitement all of a sudden be unaffected? Keep dreaming the dream. It's not coming true. If it's in Torah it's for ALL generations. When the Torah states, no assimilation and intermarriage, do you think it only refers to Canaanite women?Moriahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10031303390387367887noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-20869514633397212362012-08-05T08:50:25.051+03:002012-08-05T08:50:25.051+03:00Dear Batya,
If it is written , it is for a good p...Dear Batya,<br /><br />If it is written , it is for a good purpose. <br /><br />Thou ... If there are any righteous like Rahav, Yitro or Ruth among the people who are Israel's enemies , spare ... redeem them. <br /><br /><br />I'm 100 percent behind The Eternal Torah's Words ... Commandments.<br /><br /> And as HaShem Commands , it will be done so. <br />It is the only way.<br /><br />Classic point is the difference between King Saul and King David .<br /><br />One King did not fulfill whole fully that which God commanded them to do while the other King not only did what was commanded ... He loved God. <br /><br />What lacks today in my humble insight is not only The Knowledge of The Holy Written scripture in The young Soldiers of Israel today , but who will be the men who will be just like Kalev and Joshua ?<br /><br /><br />Who will be like King David and actually love God by doing exactly as HaShem commands ?<br /><br />Who ? <br /><br />- EdwardEdward F. Villahttp://jewishmiracles.insightonthenews.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-27412776871872151782012-08-05T08:46:52.988+03:002012-08-05T08:46:52.988+03:00a, if that's what you think, you don't und...a, if that's what you think, you don't understand modern importance of all what is written in the Torah.Batyahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09402874037427009327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7040911.post-49131656734504347732012-08-05T08:05:41.172+03:002012-08-05T08:05:41.172+03:00this is referring to the ancient canaanites, not c...this is referring to the ancient canaanites, not contemporary arabs.<br /><br />let us imagine the arabs were willing to make sincere, realistic, peace(!?!). would you still have us say no?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com